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 |  427 toploader VS 390 toploader -- bear, 06/12/2001
I was wondering if I don't figure out the trany problems the have been plaguing me with the c-6. Is the standard 390 toploader set up strong enough or would i be better of trying a jericho or the 427 toplaoder. Basically i am asking how strong is the 390 toplaoder. I don't think i could afford the jericho or the 427 toploader. |
|  | RE: 427 toploader VS 390 toploader -- Mike McQuesten, 06/12/2001
It depends on how much horsepower you're making and what you're going to do with it. I had good performance with a '68 Fairlane/Torino 390 Top Loader 4 speed in a '61 Galaxie Starliner with '64 427. I'd run a 428CJ/C-6 combo for a few years and decided it was time to make the stick switch. My friend John loaned me his complete '64 427, yup he's a good friend indeed, and I installed it in my '61 along with the top loader & Hurst shifter. I used a Center Force clutch with a Fairlane/Mustang(unibody) bellhousing. I ran it down the local strip at least a dozen times with full power shifts, M&H street slicks. It ran well for a total streeter, w/tri-power/3.89s: 14.1/100 mph. So my opinion is that a good condition 390 Top Loader will work fine with a medium performance 427, something in the 400-425 horsepower range. BTW, my friend John now owns the '61 and he's doin' it right proud. Just got done installing a complete steel 3/8" fuel line tank to pump; manual steering because of interference with the long 427 exhaust manifolds. Part of the deal with the sale was that I could take it down the strip occasionally myself. John, do you remember that? Okay, so can I ride along? "Summer's here and the time is right......" |
| | | RE: 427 toploader VS 390 toploader -- Travis Miller, 06/12/2001
Several times I have taken the complete gear set up out of a small block Top Loader and put them in a longer Galaxie tranny because the small blocks usually have the 2.78 low gear. The only mod required is shortening the snout on the input shaft. Sure is a lot easier on the clutch in those heavy Galaxies. Never tore one up on the street even behind a lo-riser 427 with lots of power shifting. I'll take the 2.78 low gear over that big jack shaft 2.32 any day. |
| | |  | RE: 427 toploader VS 390 toploader -- Mike McQuesten, 06/13/2001
One other thing John reminded me of last night when I mentioned this to him was that the big input 4 was not used in the 427 Galaxies of '64, '65, '66. The regular FE top-loader was. Also, Travis, your idea of the 2.78 gear set behind a 427 in a Galaxie is very wise. That low 1st gear helps launch those big Galactic Warriors a lot better than the close ratio 2.32. |
 | '58 Rocker Stand? -- Mike McQuesten, 06/11/2001
Here's a question for all of you "experienced" FE fanatics. I began disassembling an early '58 352 "Police Interceptor" about a year ago. It looks as if it has never been torn down before. The engine is still in a 4 door Country Sedan w/automatic. Too rusty to save. It's been sitting since 1967. Bent push rod on intake #5 cylinder may have been what put it out of commission. I pulled the adjustable rockers/shafts off at the beginning of this disassembly. I didn't look closely at them until yesterday as I started to clean them. I'm sending them to Rocker Arm Specialist Co. in Anderson, CA as cores. I'm buying their package that includes new adj. screws/locking nuts/HD shafts/aluminum spacers/HD Bilet aluminum support kit. My question here is about one of the stands on the old '58 set. The stand in question is a second one in. It has a little tube pressed into the stand. It has a unique part #: EDC-6531-0 while the other seven stands are all 6750102. All the stands are aluminum. It appears obvious that this little tube would have something to do with oiling. But what is it's purpose? This is the oldest FE I've ever been into. The car was built in October, '57. |
| intake ? -- Woodchuck, 06/11/2001
Recently ran across a intake for FE's.
Its aluminum with no identifing #s, only a Fomoco inside the oval on one side. Is this a P.I.
Will running this be a improvement over my s-code intake?
Thanks |
| | Four hole or two ovals? -- Dave Shoe, 06/11/2001
Does it have four venturi holes or two slotted holes at the carb flange?
Shoe. |
| | | For the record, I'll bet on 4 discrete holes [n/m] -- Mr F, 06/11/2001
n/m |
| | RE: Firing Order casting? -- Mike McQuesten, 06/11/2001
This sounds like an early HP intake. One thing I can tell you is that the 1960 HP aluminum intake had the firing order cast on the back left side. Very difficult to see. Might miss it if you didn't know it was there. Starting with the '61 HP, the firing order was moved up front obviously much more visable. And that's where it stayed. Doesn't tell you much but if it's a '60 with that backside F.O., it's very hard to find for a 360 Horse 352 restorer. As for real performance advantages? A nice weight savings over the S code hunk-o-iron. What intake ports/heads do you have? Check the intake ports on the intake. Big & tall ones? I don't think you should bolt it on a short intake emission port head. |
| | | Another ID. -- Paul M, 06/12/2001
We went through this trying to ID my aluminum, (no casting #'s) and I think it ended up being a `61HP intake. I'm sure Mr. Shoe will remember the pics in the Net54 forumn.
But, mine had the "FORD" script on it. I'm not sure, but the "Fomoco" come about in the mid to late `60s?
Sounds to me like a PI intake, if it's a 4 hole. |
| | RE: intake ? -- Woodchuck, 06/12/2001
Alright guys, just got off the phone about this intake.
It has two long holes on top and FOMOCO is in a rectangle not a oval. Firing order is on the right side and has the cylinders marked. Also has a hole in the back similar to distributor hole in the front. Also has anyone got the weight for a 69 429 2v? Thanks for the responses and I look foward to a answer.
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| |  | RE: intake ? -- Royce Peterson, 06/13/2001
Sounds like a 428 P.I. intake.
Royce Peterson |
| | | Now its a rectangular logo? Aw, nuts - no fair changing details. :-) [n/m] -- Mr F, 06/14/2001
n/m |
| | | RE: intake ? -- 32 valve, 06/16/2001
69 429 2v is 65lbs |
| | Here's some reference to go by. -- Paul M, 06/13/2001
Be warned this is a long thread, so sift through, and check out the pics.
http://network54.com/Hide/Forum/thread?forumid=74182&messageid=990133860
The dirty one is my intake, that I couldn't find a date code on, but it is nearly identical to the other one.
Have to wonder that it has FoMoCo script, not Ford, though.
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| | | RE: Here's some reference to go by. -- Mike McQuesten, 06/13/2001
I checked out those pics of the verified '60 HP intake along with the unverified '61 HP. Someone posted a message indicating the difference between the carb mounting base. The '60 is flat and the unverified '61 is at an angle. I hadn't realized this so thanks! Important info for we '60-'61 HP nuts. Notice that firing order on the '60 intake....there on the back left corner. Only aluminum intake from Ford with this. I never believed Hot Rod mags (or was it Fords?) contention that the '61 intake flowed 10% better but maybe it did with that change of the carb base? Also I didn't believe the '61 HP Holley was really larger in CFM than was the '60 HP Holley used. I have one of each so I'm checking 'em out tonight. One thing and this probably common knowledge among regulars on this forum now is that 352-390 Police packages through '65 were equipped with cast iron intakes. The '66 up 428 PI got the great Aluminum PI. |
| | | | Wasn't comman knowledge to me! :) -- Paul M, 06/14/2001
I like leanring new stuff about FE's. I don't know a whole lot, but I try to be accurate with what I do know.
Thanks for the info!
Regarding the `61 HP that I have. I have no way to measure the ports, and can't afford to get it flowed right now. I thought about selling it, but the only people would probably want it (aside from stuffing into a collection) is someone doing a resto, but it's got a couple visible welds, so that ideas out.
Figured I would grind it down and polish it, and use it myself :)
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| | | | Keep in mind... -- Dave Shoe, 06/14/2001
...the only reason I know of for tilting the carb flange is so the air cleaner won't bang into the hood. It is not a performance feature and is especially probable to find in smaller engine bays, such as the T-bird. I presently don't know whether the "tilted" 1961 intake was simply mounted in a low-hooded car or whether all 1961 intakes got the cut.
Shoe. |
| | | | | RE: Keep in mind... -- Mike McQuesten, 06/15/2001
We were talking about this last night. John has a '61 Starliner w/427, I have a '60 Sunliner w/427, that was originally a 352HP. I have an original '60 aluminum HP intake and the carb base is level. I wasn't aware of the '61 HP intake having the angle although I was well aware of the tri power for full size cars having the step for the three carbs vs. the t-bird intake being flat. What we were wondering about is whether the engines between the two years sat at different angles? We're going to put 'em side by side and get a level out. The '60 hood slopes down a lot. Does anyone know any reason for the '61 intake change over the '60? |
| vin no. -- MOE, 06/11/2001
Can someone break these numbers up for me.A buddy of mine says that he knows where this 427 fairlane is but the number looks like it's been played with.
------THANKS |
| 351c 4v does anyone know what I should pay? -- Ray Figueroa, 06/11/2001
Does anyone know how much I can expect to pay for a 351c V4 code is D0VA complete with manifolds? Any information you can provide will be of great help to me as I'm being offered one of these supposedly "Rare" engines. Thanks in advance for your time. |
| stroker pistons needed -- John, 06/11/2001
I have a sonic tested .060 over 427 sideoiler with 428 crank that I need pistons for. Who would carry these pistons and rings? Any help would be appreciated. |
| | RE: stroker pistons needed -- Paul M, 06/11/2001
Ross can make them for you, at about $600-$700 a set, if you can't find them elsewhere.
http://www.rosspistons.com/
click on pistons, then auto custom. |
| | | RE: stroker pistons needed -- ANT, 06/11/2001
arias or je?
one of them sells them off the shelf. Sorry I don't have my catalog handy. |
| | | | Don't do it!! -- John, 06/11/2001
Please don't do it. What a travesty for us 428 and 410 owners...to see our coveted IU's used to stroke a 427. Don't you know that you're likely never to need the combination you're planning to build...revs?...go 427..hey use a 390 crank to save money...torque?...go 428...but to waste the hard to find, and getting more expensive when you do find, IU cranks,...egad!...Why don't you sell me that long stroke crank....I'll even trade....I'll buy you 427 pistons...even include rings if you're a haggler! OK, OK....I give in...name your price!....But, in all sincerity, I am thinking of giving up on the FE...the 428 crank is so hard to find and costs Mega$$ these days, and a 427 block which is probably already at 0.03 overbored probably doesn't have much of a life left. Dove is $ and doesn't have a good rep for the quality of their products. I did once get in touch with a billet crank manufacturer...lol...they wanted about $4K for set-up charges to make me one...not that I think they were over-charging for their required efforts, but just that I couldn't afford it. I really wish a good source for 428 cranks could be found, because there are a lot of 360/390 blocks still around, and a 410 engine is pretty darned good, plus it was a factory original...UNLIKE your PROPOSED combination. Whew!......think I made my point? |
| | | | | Hey, wait a minute! Don't dis the 390! -- Dave Shoe, 06/11/2001
You may not have a 428 crank or 427 block lsying around the house, but a 390 kicks ass when properly prepared. If you find a nice FT block, you can reliably pop into the 400+ cube range, too.
A "short stroke" 390 will rev nicely compared to a long stroke 410. It's got 95% of the cubes a 410 has, but can rev higher to make up the difference. It's also got 91% of the cubes that a 428 has. It's a piece of cake to build a 390 that's faster than my 452CID FE, mianly because I don't have to cam it up much to make lotsa power. Also, a 390 can be made to sound frightening next to my mild big bore block.
Don't go discounting the 390 so fast. I'm tempted to play in the 352-390 area but have easy cubes laying around which sorta prevents me from doing so. You're lucky - you ain't stuck with the big stuff. You CAN build a 390 that'll outlast a built Windsor, outpower most any engine outside of modern mountain motors, and you can do it for cheap from the guts found under the hood of an old pickup or Galaxie.
If you got a hankering to leave the FE arena, it ain't for lack of cheap and available parts - it's either for a lack of understanding the FE, or perhaps because you find in yourself a need to take a more mainstream approach to engine building. FEs are not mainstream, but they don't have to be expensive, either.
Shoe. |
| | | | | | RE: Hey, wait a minute! Don't dis the 390! -- bear, 06/12/2001
i agree with shoe i run an aluminum headed 390 in my 83 ford ranger 2wd and i love whooping 5.0's . people think i am running a 302 in it until i open the hood and there jaws hit the ground. I am running hyper piston's $16 dollars a piece 10.5 compression a lunati cam. harlnd sharp roller rockers and shafts and the edelbrock heads with the matching performer rpm dual plane. stock PI rods with the arp wave lock rod bolts. counting machine work and heads i have around $3500 in the engine and it runs like a raped ape. |
| | | | | RE: Don't do it!! -- bear, 06/11/2001
Carls fords in homeworthe ohio ells 428 short blocks for $1200 dollars. and 428 cranks with various cut for around $300 to $500 dollars? somewhere in that price range.
Bear
Ford traders have his adds in them with a web adress but i can't remember the website off the top of my head. I hope that helps you and the cranks are cheaper than the pistons would be |
| | | | | Why not? -- John, 06/12/2001
Sorry, but I want to build this one for the street not racing so the extra cubes will make up for less RPM,s. As for the 428 cranks shop around as I still see them selling for $250. The piston cost does concern me and any help is appreciated. Thanks, John |
| | | | | | RE: Why not? -- John, 06/12/2001
Guess I stepped in horse doo-doo again with my note "Don't do it" Just for the record, my interest in the 428 rests solely with my car that only ever came with a 428 or a 427, so regardless of performance of a 390, I find a problem with having anything else under the hood, although I admit, a 410 somehow seems acceptable. Perhaps I just don't like seeing a bigblock with less than 400 c.i. Silly of me I guess. My car is an ERA 427SC Cobra. Interestingly, a long term racing nut I know, who always used the FE, says he likes the response of a done over 360 better than the larger displacements. To each his own I suppose. I will certainly keep looking for an extra 428 crank in the $250 range. I know e-bay is a crappy place to look, but they are there, and always seem to sell for over $400. And for those of you who may not know, I have to pay an extra 60 cents on the dollar when I import from the United States into Canada(approx current exchange rate), so that $400 crank suddenly goes up to $640. |
| 390 crank-flywheel -- Rob Twine, 06/10/2001
First time FE builder, so bear with me. Three of the bolt holes line up perfectly on the crank shaft, however, the other holes on the flywheel seem to be off 1/32 to 1/16 from the crank shaft. Can these holes be enlarged, is this a viable fix, or am I setting myself up for other problems? Any help would be appreciated. Rob Twine |
| Manual Choke -- Brett G, 06/10/2001
Was a manual choke an available on 68 GT 390 |
| 4 speed shift handle disassembly -- Greg R, 06/10/2001
I have an early Galaxie 4 speed shift handle that I'd like to have rechromed. Is there a way to disassemble the reverse lock-out? I'd like to have just the main part of the handle rechromed and only want to send this one part. Thanks for any help. |
| | RE: 4 speed shift handle disassembly -- John R. Barnes, 06/10/2001
I would use Bill Heely in Maryland, he does a 3 day turnaround on just about any Ford shifter. |
| | OK, just a couple more shifter questions -- Greg R, 06/10/2001
Well, I now know how the shifters were put together. I had a garbage handle (bent, broken, rusted, etc) so I cut the cable inside. Seems the lockout tab at the bottom is welded (?) to the cable. With this in mind, how in the world do I get a new shift boot on this thing? Also, I can't seem to get the knob to thread off and I don't want to take the chance of wrecking it. I've seen what these shifters sell for and I really don't want to shell out the dough for a replacement. Thanks for any help.
 |
| Wanted: Complete 428cj motor for my 69 Mustang -- Larry, 06/09/2001
Looking for a complete 428cj motor for my 69 Mustang R code. Preferrably located in the SE US. But if you have one for sale, please EMAIL me. I check my email daily, but I get a chance to check the boards only on the weekend.
Please email me with the specifics if you have a motor for sale.
Thanks much!
Larry
larry@69mustang.com |
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