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 |  Clearances -- John, 05/23/2001
Looking to upgrade my 390 breathing capabilities.
1964 T-bird. Underhood is very tight.
Any suggestions on manifolds and exhaust (headers) would be appreciated.
Thanks in advance for any help.
John |
 | What is the CURRENT Ford part # for... -- Walker, 05/23/2001
What is the current Ford part number for the 428 oil filter adapter?
Tried getting it from two different local Ford dealers' part departments. The one who actually came up with a valid part number came up with a $100 adapter for a truck (filter screws on from the side, instead of from the bottom).
A real, current, Ford part number would be greatly appreciated.
Thank you. |
|  | RE: What is the CURRENT Ford part # for... -- gerry, 05/23/2001
C0AZ-6881-A $36.00 from any ford parts department. |
| |  | Thank you very much! eom -- Walker, 05/23/2001
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| | | Is that for the regular or the "high'flow"? N/M -- Leo, 05/26/2001
n/m |
| | | | the current part is based on the final 'high flow' -- Walker, 05/27/2001
the current part is based on the final 'high flow' design. |
| | | |  | Thanks! n/m -- Leo, 05/27/2001
n/m |
| History of the Autolite 4100 4V carb -- Ed Jenkins, 05/22/2001
1957 was the very first year, in 1957 it ( the 600 CFM version) was used on 312 V8's, in 1958 a special version was created and only used on the Mercury "383 High Torque" engine it flowed 669 CFM ( not for bad for a factory stock carb! ). in 1963 another special version was made the " High Performance 4100" affectionately nicknamed the 4100 HI PO it flowed 600 CFM and featured a manual choke (except the 63-64 Fairlanes, 63 Meteors and 64 Comets which had automatic chokes). This carb was used from 1963 to 1967. It was used on Fairlanes, Comets, Meteors, Mustangs, (was also used as a service replacement in 1967) and Shelby Hertz cars. In 1964 1/2 the smaller 480 CFM version was introduced, and the 480 is the only size 4V carb used on the 289 except for the HI PO 289 engines which featured the HI PO 4100. The Autolite 4100 was used on 289's, 352's, 390's and 428's until 1966 and on a few 428's through 1968 ( virtually all Ford cars of the late 50's, and mid 60's that had 4V carbs from the Factory had Autoite 4100's. The Autolite 4300 ( latter to become the Motor craft 4350) replaced the 4100 in 1967 due to increased emissions requirements.
The regular 600 CFM version was used on 352's, 390's, and 428's possibly a Mercury 410, or even some 360's too but I don't know for sure. The 600 CFM version was used also in Full sized Fords and Mercurys.
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| | RE: History of the Autolite 4100 4V carb -- RC Moser, 05/23/2001
The Mercury FE's also got them. My 66 410 has the 600 CFM one and has only been rebuilt twice. I was unaware that they were first introduced in the 50's. Nice information Ed, Thanks |
| | I forgot about the Edsels. It was also used..... -- ED Jenkins, 05/24/2001
..on them too (the 600 CFM version) |
| | RE: History of the Autolite 4100 4V carb -- Mike McQuesten, 05/25/2001
I'm not disagreeing with you Ed about the marvelous performance of FoMoCo in all years. I just would like to know more about where you got your information about those 4100 HIPO carbs with manual chokes on Ford products from '64 - '67. I've seen quite a few Hi Po 289s and Shelby GT350 Hertz Mustangs. They all had automatic chokes. They also were cast with the 1.08 float bowl. That's right, even the 271 HP. The last 1.12 Autolite 4100 4V carb that I ever saw stock was on a '62 390 Ford vehicle. I took it off a Merc Park Colony and have run it on a number of FEs. I've got a good friend who specializes in 4100s, he loves 'em and always gives me a hard time when I run a holley. By the way, why did Ford run Holleys on the 352/360, 390/375, 406/385, 427/410, 390 GT, etc.? They should have been running those 669s! I mean it. I've looked a long time for one of the fabled 1.19s. I know a few were built but I don't believe they were after 1959. |
| | | RE: History of the Autolite 4100 4V carb -- Neppy, 05/25/2001
I've got a 1.12 on my '66 Galaxie w/352. I'm pretty sure it's all original, since I have records on everything, except gas receipts. I think they used the 1.12 on a lot of vehicles in the mid and late sixties. |
| | | | RE: History of the Autolite 4100 4V carb -- Mike McQuesten, 05/25/2001
It's strange that Ford was installing a 1.12(600 CFM) on a '66 352 which is a low compression engine. A '65 Galaxie XL 390-4V with 4 speed that I bought from the original owner had a 1.08(480 cfm). I called a knowledgable friend last night regarding this discussion and he has never seen anything later than '64 with a 1.12. I want to make sure it's clear that I'd just like to know how these 4100s were applied. I'd like some verification. These are great carburetors and increasingly difficult to find. Is it possible your '66 had the carb replaced with a rebuilt 4100? You're sure it's the original? That would be very interesting. |
| | | | | 66 was the last year for the 4100 on regular...... -- ED Jenkins, 05/25/2001
.....production street cars. It lasted until 68 on 428's but most of these were police intercepter models. I belive that the public iditocracy ( the general public knows far less then they can ever realize) is the main reason that Ford used Holleys on some of their HIPO engines, the Autolite 4100 was much very often misunderstood through out its life time, no one could figure out how to get the secondaries to open up corectly, etc. So the public wanted Holley's and thats what Ford put on there attention getter HIPO engines. The 600 cfm 4100 will out perform the 600 Holley. THe 352 isn't so bad. You can make as high as 400 HP out of a stock bore and stroke. I've got one in a 66 Gal that'll move pretty quick. |
| | | | | | RE: 66 was the last year for the 4100 on regular...... -- Mike McQuesten, 05/25/2001
I agree with you about the misperceptions regarding the autolite 4100s. They're a lot easier to work with than old leaking, float sticking/sinking Holleys. And I know they were used commonly through '66 and like you say sporadically into '68. My questions are - when was the last 600 CFM (1.12) used? I looked at a '66 Washington State Patrol Car last summer that looked totally correct and according to the Montana owner it was correct. It had a 1.08 autlite 4100 mounted on top of that aluminum C6AE intake manifold. Second question - what documentation proves that the "HIPO 4100" was ever used in any application from '64 - '67? As you described this mythical carb....manual choke, 669/600CFM, on Comets, Fairlanes, Meterors, etc. In my fifty three years of over the line Total Performance Ford fantacism I've never seen this application. Please don't think I'm saying it ain't so, I just want to know. Thanks. |
| | | | | | | I have a cool book..... -- Ed, 05/25/2001
....from Pony carbs that I read awhile back. I can scan you pages out of it if you like. |
| | | | | | | | RE: Thanks -- Mike McQuesten, 05/25/2001
I'd like to thank Ed for bringing this subject up. I and many local friends like autolite 4100s a lot. We thought we knew quite a bit about them but you've opened our eyes and our minds here. We can keep on learnin'! And I'm gonna keep on lookin' for one of those 1.19 big 'uns. |
| | | | | | | | | I have a way to HOP UP the Autolite....... -- ED Jenkins, 05/25/2001
....if anyone is intersted? |
| | | | | | | hipo 4100 man choke not mythical -- joe ligon, 05/25/2001
we had one rebuilt for a customer last year. original 65 mustang k code gt coupe. 600 cfm 1.12 with manual choke provision. he came back to us after taking it to a resto shop for paint.he told us it wasn't running right. we pop the hood and we notice the carb is different a regular big ford 1.12 c4ae num on base but his manual choke has been put on it. he then remembers that the resto guys had swapped it out for him because it wasn't running right when he took it there.well it wasn't running right now because the manual choke mechanism doesn't mount exactly like the automatic choke and there was a vacuum leak in the side of the carb. needless to say we sent him right back to the resto shop to get his correct carb back(he did and we had that one rebuilt) |
| | | | | Fuel economy and realability are the main......... -- ED Jenkins, 05/25/2001
.....reasons also the insurance companies were probobly looking over the shoulders of Ford designers in the mid 60's so Ford had to design a way to reduce their regualar production motors horsepower. By over carbing the 352 and under carbing the 390 Ford accomplished this. It also could have been a production mistake. Ford did alot of funny things back then to keep a production line running. |
| | | | | | RE: Fuel economy and realability are the main......... -- Richard Swart, 05/26/2001
Ed, I would be real interested on the hop up's for the 4100. Please and thank you. Richard |
| | | | | | | I'd be interested in those hop ups too, Ed. -- Neppy, 05/27/2001
Thanks. |
| | | | | Main reason I'm really sure is that.... -- Neppy, 05/26/2001
I'm the second owner of the car. Sorta. The original owner's grand daughter sold it to her boyfriends dad. He sold it to me. No one ever switched the title. So on paper I'm the second owner (still have the orig title). Neither were the rebuilding types, if you know what I mean. The old choke tube was frozen from the years of neglect. May not prove it but I have no doubts. The guy I bought it from was into Porches and never got around to fixing anything on "that old Ford". I just figured from his attitude towards the car that he either didn't know enough to fix it or didn't care enough. Probably the latter. |
| | | | | | RE: I'm a believer! -- Mike McQuesten, 05/27/2001
You're right about that 4100 manual choke Joe. This discussion motivated me to finally get the old '66 Mustang/Fairlane shop manuals off the shelf tonight to have a look. Looked at the '64 Fairlane manual too. The '64 F-lane manual shows the 4100 4V w/automatic choke. Nothing on 1.08/1.12. Then the '66 shop manual does show a manual choke 4100! And now Neppy I believe you too about that 352 with a 1.12. It surprises me that a 600 CFM would be installed at the factory on a 352. Especially when my '65 390 had a 1.08. That engine still provides great service in my '68 F-100. I did install a C6OZ-6250B cam with the rebuild. So who knows? What I do know is that this old dog can still learn a few things. Oh and about the power of 352s Ed, I believe you too. I have an original '60 352-360 horse engine stored in the corner of my shop. That big FE can power a two ton Galaxie easily into the mid 14's on street tires. Here's one last question - I have a 4100 with EDC embossed on the left of the float bowl. I can't find anyother numbers/codes/stampings or tags. Might this be one of the very early 4100s? |
| | | | | | | RE: I'm a believer! -- joe ligon, 05/27/2001
it was one of fords "brighter" ideas to change the hipo manifold on the passenger side for the mustang in 64, up until then the p/s hipo manifold had a bung(almost like one for an O2 sensor) cast into it to receive the choke tube setup. i wish they'd recast that one as well as the mustang one so that you aren't forced to run a manual or electric choke with those manifolds.
joe |
| | | | | | | | RE: I'm a believer! -- richard, 05/29/2001
i am a believer in these carbs as well. i had one on my 289 and with an erson cam in it i got 26mpg on the road. i was thinking of putting an edelbrock 750 on my 351w i am building for the mustang but now i will look for a 1.12 or the rarer 1.19 autolite. and ed i too am interested in the autolite hop up. e-mail me at falcon2@shentel.net with the info. if you are of a mind to do so. thanks. |
| 390 / 352 Oil filter adaptor -- Robb, 05/21/2001
We are doing an engine swap in my 65 Galaxie that can with a 352 2V "X". Took a 68 LTD with a 390 4V "Z". My problem is , I've manage to miss up the oil filter adaptor during all the parts clean up process. I can make out the part number pretty good on one of them, which is "C8AE-6881-4", with the "FOMOCO" logo and the number "2" above that. The other I can only make out only the last few charaters which are "-6884-A" with the "FORD" logo and the number "2" above it. They both look pretty much the same, but when I put the bolt holes pattens back to back, they dont' seems to really match up. Which gives me some concerns, not wanting to assume any thing.
Hope someone can help me.
And as always Thanks for any and all responses.
Robb J |
| | RE: 390 / 352 Oil filter adaptor -- Kam, 05/22/2001
Robb;
Try your local Ford dealer, the service part has larger passages as used in the 427. about $40.
Kam |
| | | Actually, the C8 part is the piece you describe. -- Dave Shoe, 05/22/2001
All FEs got that brand new large-runner oil filter adapter in 1968. It was not available before that, though there were some exotic XE-numbered pieces floating around the 427 camp for a few years, but these looked way different.
A more common 427 adapter was the twin sending unit small passage adapter (pressure and temp). These worked fine, as does any FE adapter.
All blocks are drilled the same, so either adapter will work on either block. My favorite is the large passage C8.
There is a different gasket style for the two common adapters. I'm not sure whether the gaskets can be mix-matched between adapter types, but a quick comparison should show you what you need to know.
There is a third type of gasket found on some "horizontal filter" pickup trucks which I know is not compatible with the two types you have - the blocks are drilled the same, but I'm certain you've gotta use the correct gasket with that oddball truck adapter.
Shoe. |
| Intake ID -- Danny, 05/21/2001
I have an FE itake that has a casting # of C9ZE 9425 B
With a matching alum carb spacer C9ZE 9A589 A
the primary holes are aprox 1.61 the secondary's are aprox 1.70 the ports at the gasket measure aprox
1.18 X 1.80 , Does anyone know what this came off of
it is the first one I have seen with a C9ZE cast # and the first one I have had with two differant size carb holes |
| | RE: Intake ID 69 mustang gt 390 (NM) -- gerald, 05/21/2001
nm |
| Overheating -- Paul, 05/21/2001
My 352 seems to be running hot. The thermostat appears to be working because I see flow in the radiator when the engine comes up to temperature. Could this be timing or spark plugs or is it something in the cooling system? Also, I am running a new Edelbrock waterpump. |
| | Check for timing/advance, clogged block & 'too-lean' fuel supply. [n/m] -- Mr F, 05/22/2001
n/m |
| | | RE: Mr. F Overheating -- Paul, 05/22/2001
Mr. F.....Hey thanks for the feedback. What is the best way to check for a clogged block? Timing is set at 6 BTDC? The carb is an Edelbrock 650 with factory settings. I have not adjusted anything. |
| | | | Also look for rusty head gaskets. -- Dave Shoe, 05/22/2001
You didn't mention why you think the engine is overheating - different symptoms will suggest different solutions. Also, did the overheating problem start long after you installed the Edelbrock pump, right at the time you installed the Ed pump, or was it a problem prior to installing the Ed pump.
If the head gasket is rusted, it can open up the restriction near the front of both heads which is intended to direct most coolant toward the back of the block. and into the rear of the head.
When this restriction is sufficiently rusted away, coolant will tend to flow from the water pump, into the front of the block, directly into the front of the head, and out the intake manifold, with onlt minimal flow going toward the rear of the engine and rear of the heads.
Shoe. |
| | | | Sorry, but there's no 'sure-fire' method. [n/m] -- Mr F, 05/22/2001
n/m |
| | RE: Overheating -- RC Moser, 05/23/2001
Paul, give us some more information or history. As Dave suggested. When did the problem occur? Has it been rebuilt and how long ago? overbored or not? Condition of hoses and radiator? What you've done to it? Discribe the overheating systom's? Puk water, gauge indication, hear the thumping sound, slow cranking? Now, if you havn't allready check the following condition of the radiator/cooling fins. Hoses (some have springs to prevent colasping) Radiator cap, Condition of the coolant (does it look greasey or dirty) The only way to check the block is to knock a freeze plug out (only it the engine hasn't been rebuilt or flushed out for a very long time) sometimes sludge will build up in the water jacket's that surround the cylinders causing poor circulation, but this is caused over a very long period of time and not likely after a rebuild. You can also do a search and see what other's have encountered and what fixed their problems. Kind of long, sorry. |
| | | RE: Overheating -- mike m, 04/21/2002
i need help! i have a 71 cj351 just rebuilt it is 30 over bore 10.5trw pistons heads reworked,when it runs for about 30 min. it starts to loose oil presssure from 80lbs to about10lbs can't find why it is running that hot. thanks |
| | | | Post your question as 'new' or no one will see it. [n/m] -- Mr F, 04/21/2002
n/m |
| 410 Pistons -- Karl Jacobsen, 05/21/2001
Does anyone have a source for oversize pistons for a
'66 Merc. 410 engine?
Thanks |
| | RE: 410 Pistons -- Mike McQuesten, 05/21/2001
Why don't you have the block's cylinders sonic tested for thickness? It's very possible that you can go standard bore 428 pistons. As for 410 pistons, the last place I saw that carried them was J.C. Whitney and they were just available as cast which was stock. |
| | RE: 410 Pistons -- Richard Bouman, 05/21/2001
Silv-o-lite 410 pistons part number 1139. These are cast like the factory ones. Mine are .030 over
look real good. Cost $143 out the door. |
| Carbs for 427 tunnelport -- John, 05/20/2001
Im in need for some 715 carbs for my 2X4 tunnelport intake. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks! |
| | RE: Carbs for 427 tunnelport -- Will, 05/20/2001
You just missed a set on ebay. The bidding closed about a week ago. You could try Carls's Ford Parts - http://www.carlsfordparts.com. He may have the Holley reissue carbs. |
| | | RE: Carbs for 427 tunnelport -- John, 05/20/2001
Pony Carburators made a set of 550's for my 2X4 428. Thay worked just fine! They seem to know about twin set-ups. They advertise in Hemmings, but if you have a problem finding them, e-mail me and I'll look up their # and address for you.
Now, you can put on a set of plain old Holleys of the size you want, modify or buy the proper parts to tie the vacumn secondaries together (easy job, I used two 90 degree grease fittings with the guts removed to make air fittings) and...restrict the primary idle circuit in both carbs(use fine steel wire) or you will find the idle screws all the way "IN" and still not runnning "peaked". |
| | You want vintage, original Ford/Holley carbs or later ones? [n/m] -- Mr F, 05/21/2001
n/m |
| | | Would be nice to have the origionals -- John, 07/09/2001
Can you help? |
| | | | Sure, but they're not cheap. To write me, see 'Feedback' (above) [n/m] -- Mr F, 07/09/2001
n/m |
| harmonic balancer -- phil, 05/19/2001
please help. I just had my 352 rebuilt out of a '64 galaxie and I don't see any harmonic balancer, just a pot metal gear looking thing. Is this right or did they forget to put on the harmonic balancer. Thank you |
| | Your damper would be the rear-most crankpulley. -- Dave Shoe, 05/19/2001
Look closer at the crank pulleys.
It's possible, if you have multiple grooves on your crankpulley that the actual damper is underneath the stamped-steel pulleys.
I believe the stock damper for your motor was a single-grooved cast iron ring (.75" wide, front to back) with a belt groove in it. Not very massive, but it did the job on the street, and it was more massive than the original FE damper. If your car has no options, this might be the pulley which was used. If it has a higher output generator or alternator, AC, PS, or any other options, this damper would sometimes get cast pulleys bolted to it's front and other times get covered up by optional steel crank pulleys.
If in doubt, remove the three bolts which hold the crank pulley in place and see what's underneath. Note the optional steel pulley (if you have one) is keyed (for timing). Be sure to reinstall it so the tab mates properly to the crank.
JMO,
Shoe. |
| | | RE: Your damper would be the rear-most crankpulley. -- phil, 05/19/2001
thank you,I'll check it out. That sounds like what I've got. You've put my mind somewhat at ease. Phil |
| 428 Industrial Block?? -- Bob Enright, 05/19/2001
I am currently looking at a 428 CJ engine to purchace. The guy says it has C80E-6090-N Heads, the block has C4C markings by the oil filter housing. He claims when looking in the freeze out plug holes there is about 1/8 inch clearance between cyul walls. The rods are C7A-E's. Block is bored 40 over & has nylen pistons. The block (he says) has extra webbing added to the outside in six places. What kinda block is this? I know the heads are ok as is the IUB crank. Anyone ever seen one of these? He claims its a industrial block. He is about 2,500 miles from me so all I can do is look at pic's. Thanx....Bob |
| | RE: 428 Industrial Block?? -- Lou, 05/20/2001
Maybe a marine block, but a industrial...what was it used for? Something tell me you should pass on this. |
| | | RE: 428 Industrial Block?? -- Dave Shoe, 05/21/2001
You could find 428 blocks in irrigation and farm equipment applications in the early '70s when the competition was 413 Chrysler Industrial engines.
I don't know much about them (yet).
Shoe. |
| | RE: 428 Industrial Block?? -- john bach, 05/23/2001
i would suggest that all you ford lovers out there to purchase a book,"high performance ford, 221to 460, engine parts interchange by "Cartech" 1-800-551-4754 in minnesota. it has a wealth of very useful info on big and small block fords. |
| | | RE: 428 Industrial Block?? -- Barry B, 05/23/2001
If that’s the book by SA-Design, it has a lot of nice pictures but also a lot of confusing information, at least for the FE. The best books I’ve seen for Fords are the HP Books. |
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